Cranmer says Henry 'was almost ... fatherly' to John Lambert. Cromwell: 'Yes, he was.' Thinking, surely, of Walter. 'Ripping and stamping, rage in the eye. Sipping blood from the body cavity, then slashing again at the flesh.' See also: Goya, Saturn Devouring His Son.
This juxtaposition is terrifying, isn't it? I also just stumbled across the fact that 'fatherly' is the word that Cromwell advised Norfolk to substitute for 'divine' back in Salvage ("It gives the same idea, but without hyperbole.")
Cranmer's wife's unhappy state becomes a metaphor for all of us: ‘We are living on borrowed time, in small rooms, a bag always packed , an ear always alert; we sleep lightly and some nights hardly at all.’
The nightingale makes me think of Bess Darrell. He's paid her to sing for him, but a nightingale will sing for any owner--and he's incriminated himself in front of her. I do think there is something being said in that Christophe thinks Matthew paid too much, but I don't feel clever enough to figure it out.
'We shall prosper, son.' (Cromwell to Rafe) I was very touched by that; on the one hand, naming Rafe for what he is to him and on the other, in the light of what happens next. I hope at least Rafe survives (I haven't dared to look yet) .
Gardiner: In the scene when the boy Cromwell is encircled by the dogs after the old woman has been burned, I already had to think of him. Also in last week's pages how the dogs around the memorial are barely kept at bay. Bloodhounds with the face of Gardiner and don't know who else will be involved in bringing down Cromwell (I have my suspects).
On the culinary front I seem to have to accept that the time of feasting and dinning is over. There has been hardly anything in the last two weeks. These are barren times, I am afraid it won't get any better...
Gardiner feasts on the destruction of people, I'm afraid!
And I forgot: Get well soon! If it is Gardinitis (copyright Simon Haisell, I was ill a couple of months ago and was diagnosed with it according to Master Simon), please take care of yourself. It is a sneaky, troublesome disease, you think it's getting better and then it creeps back again!
Thank you Simon for this post despite your illness, it is appreciated. Gardiner's appearance is not appreciated, nor is the fact that we're moving into 1539. It is interesting to me how much more I have noticed the mention of mirrors and lights in this re-read, I genuinely think this slow read has changed my approach to reading and slowed it down with all books. The image of Henry all in white is stuck in my head, and it's not necessarily a welcome one.
Never invite Gardiner anywhere. Feel better Simon.
Cromwell is struggling with his legacy and it seems that it is his religious reforms that he is most proud of, although he realizes that others have a stronger faith.
This was such a rich week's reading, I am convinced that Gardiner struck you down on purpose to prevent you mining its depths... I would have loved to see your thoughts on Cromwell describing Henry as "the mirror and light of all other kings and princes in Christendom" while "riven by horror and desolation". I hope you're feeling better now!
Cromwell comes unusually close to explaining himself in that conversation with Cranmer: "You can't pick and choose, if you serve a prince, week to week or cause to cause. Sometimes all you can do is lessen the damage. But here we failed."
One phrase that leapt out at me that I'd never noticed before was "in thrall to a useless sacrifice in an alien land" in Cromwell's musings on faith - if I'm reading this right, it seems shocking that he could even consider this perspective!
The line "But he has got over that now" (about his previous conscience-led efforts to save evangelists) struck me as one of the most chilling of the whole trilogy.
Overall this section feels pivotal - Cromwell has stopped pretending even to himself that he is led by his conscience rather than an instinct for survival, and Rafe criticises him openly (for the first time that I've noticed, anyway) for not going further to protect himself.
It also feels very quotable - I'm going to indulge myself with a few:
- "It is dismaying to him, that Stephen has been gone three years, and his urge to knock him down is as strong as ever."
- when dismay finally shows on Margaret Pole's face, "that is nothing to the dismay on the face of Lady Fitzwilliam, when he tells her the Countess of Salisbury will be living with them, for how long no one knows."
- "He knows Lady Lisle dislikes him. She dislikes what he is - a jack-in-office - and makes him feel that his manner, his address, gives him away as a pot-boy."
- "John Lambert is used to defending himself in small rooms. He is courageous, but he is not a man who has ever had to rise to an occasion; and here is his king, the maker of occasions."
So much here. Yes I'm going to go back and write this week up properly next year. Just one thing I want to pick out: that conversation with Rafe. Rafe says Robert Barnes did himself no harm that day. The implication is that Cromwell did harm himself. But then he remained silent for his own survival. So I was wondering what Rafe meant: that it would actually have helped Cromwell to have spoken out. I keep playing this conversation around in circles.
It goes back to Hilary Mantel's alternative title for the trilogy: something like A Dialogue between Law and Conscience. Well, exactly.
Cromwell says that Barnes played the hypocrite, so I was assuming that (even though he only got through the day by going out and throwing up) he had added his voice to the chorus supporting Henry's position; that was what I thought Rafe was saying Cromwell should have done.
Cranmer says Henry 'was almost ... fatherly' to John Lambert. Cromwell: 'Yes, he was.' Thinking, surely, of Walter. 'Ripping and stamping, rage in the eye. Sipping blood from the body cavity, then slashing again at the flesh.' See also: Goya, Saturn Devouring His Son.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saturn_Devouring_His_Son
This juxtaposition is terrifying, isn't it? I also just stumbled across the fact that 'fatherly' is the word that Cromwell advised Norfolk to substitute for 'divine' back in Salvage ("It gives the same idea, but without hyperbole.")
Well noted. I was thinking of that too!
Cranmer's wife's unhappy state becomes a metaphor for all of us: ‘We are living on borrowed time, in small rooms, a bag always packed , an ear always alert; we sleep lightly and some nights hardly at all.’
Footnote: Did Cromwell actually buy a nightingale for one mark. What say you, Thomas Avery?
Tangent: What is the symbolism and significance of the nightingale?
The nightingale makes me think of Bess Darrell. He's paid her to sing for him, but a nightingale will sing for any owner--and he's incriminated himself in front of her. I do think there is something being said in that Christophe thinks Matthew paid too much, but I don't feel clever enough to figure it out.
Coming back to say, of course! Cromwell pays too dear a price--his life--in return for all the nightingales he bought.
Ahhhh! Brilliant! Thanks Willow, that's a brilliant observation.
'We shall prosper, son.' (Cromwell to Rafe) I was very touched by that; on the one hand, naming Rafe for what he is to him and on the other, in the light of what happens next. I hope at least Rafe survives (I haven't dared to look yet) .
Gardiner: In the scene when the boy Cromwell is encircled by the dogs after the old woman has been burned, I already had to think of him. Also in last week's pages how the dogs around the memorial are barely kept at bay. Bloodhounds with the face of Gardiner and don't know who else will be involved in bringing down Cromwell (I have my suspects).
On the culinary front I seem to have to accept that the time of feasting and dinning is over. There has been hardly anything in the last two weeks. These are barren times, I am afraid it won't get any better...
Lambert was sent food and wine, but no further details. It feels like the feasting is over. Gardiner looks hungry though...
Gardiner feasts on the destruction of people, I'm afraid!
And I forgot: Get well soon! If it is Gardinitis (copyright Simon Haisell, I was ill a couple of months ago and was diagnosed with it according to Master Simon), please take care of yourself. It is a sneaky, troublesome disease, you think it's getting better and then it creeps back again!
Bouts of nausea, put right off my breakfast. Classic Gardinitis. Suggested remedy: send him back to France!
Thank you Simon for this post despite your illness, it is appreciated. Gardiner's appearance is not appreciated, nor is the fact that we're moving into 1539. It is interesting to me how much more I have noticed the mention of mirrors and lights in this re-read, I genuinely think this slow read has changed my approach to reading and slowed it down with all books. The image of Henry all in white is stuck in my head, and it's not necessarily a welcome one.
I'm feeling the weight in my stomach, and it's not just the after effects of being ill. Mantel does this. I don't want it to be 1539 either.
This is why the slow read is also necessary, we all share the sickening feeling together.
Never invite Gardiner anywhere. Feel better Simon.
Cromwell is struggling with his legacy and it seems that it is his religious reforms that he is most proud of, although he realizes that others have a stronger faith.
I'm sorry you are unwell. Damn that Stephen Gardiner. I hope you're feeling better soon.
I felt sick as soon I saw him. Thankfully, Christophe and I have shared some aqua vitae.
This was such a rich week's reading, I am convinced that Gardiner struck you down on purpose to prevent you mining its depths... I would have loved to see your thoughts on Cromwell describing Henry as "the mirror and light of all other kings and princes in Christendom" while "riven by horror and desolation". I hope you're feeling better now!
Cromwell comes unusually close to explaining himself in that conversation with Cranmer: "You can't pick and choose, if you serve a prince, week to week or cause to cause. Sometimes all you can do is lessen the damage. But here we failed."
One phrase that leapt out at me that I'd never noticed before was "in thrall to a useless sacrifice in an alien land" in Cromwell's musings on faith - if I'm reading this right, it seems shocking that he could even consider this perspective!
The line "But he has got over that now" (about his previous conscience-led efforts to save evangelists) struck me as one of the most chilling of the whole trilogy.
Overall this section feels pivotal - Cromwell has stopped pretending even to himself that he is led by his conscience rather than an instinct for survival, and Rafe criticises him openly (for the first time that I've noticed, anyway) for not going further to protect himself.
It also feels very quotable - I'm going to indulge myself with a few:
- "It is dismaying to him, that Stephen has been gone three years, and his urge to knock him down is as strong as ever."
- when dismay finally shows on Margaret Pole's face, "that is nothing to the dismay on the face of Lady Fitzwilliam, when he tells her the Countess of Salisbury will be living with them, for how long no one knows."
- "He knows Lady Lisle dislikes him. She dislikes what he is - a jack-in-office - and makes him feel that his manner, his address, gives him away as a pot-boy."
- "John Lambert is used to defending himself in small rooms. He is courageous, but he is not a man who has ever had to rise to an occasion; and here is his king, the maker of occasions."
So much here. Yes I'm going to go back and write this week up properly next year. Just one thing I want to pick out: that conversation with Rafe. Rafe says Robert Barnes did himself no harm that day. The implication is that Cromwell did harm himself. But then he remained silent for his own survival. So I was wondering what Rafe meant: that it would actually have helped Cromwell to have spoken out. I keep playing this conversation around in circles.
It goes back to Hilary Mantel's alternative title for the trilogy: something like A Dialogue between Law and Conscience. Well, exactly.
Cromwell says that Barnes played the hypocrite, so I was assuming that (even though he only got through the day by going out and throwing up) he had added his voice to the chorus supporting Henry's position; that was what I thought Rafe was saying Cromwell should have done.
Ah of course, Cromwell stayed silennt and spoke neither for Henry nor his conscience. Fear struck him, and through him, it struck us.
Feel better Simon!
Thanks Gabby! Feeling much better today.