That last line, "I can’t slow down, if I stopped to think how I was doing it I couldn’t do it at all" takes on such an ominous meaning when you think about what's to come. Liz's fingers had the surety of a skilled craftsperson such that she couldn't do her work slowly- but hers was an act of creation. Cromwell's act, that he can't think too slowly about, is an act of destruction. And now I'm wondering what Liz would have made of what he's about to do.
I tried to vote in the survey on desktop, and it gave me an error, but I was able to vote via the app on my phone.
I wonder this often. Would more women around him have made him less likely to take the route he ultimately chooses? If Liz had survived would he have made the same choices?
I've wondered that too. He's careful to send Gregory away so he won't have to witness it if it goes bad. Would he have avoided it all if Liz and the girls had lived?
There's a moment near the end of the chapter when Call-Me gives Cromwell a "glassy look" regarding Cromwell's shrug about a rumor of a marriage between Mary and a subject. Mantel then writes about Cromwell's understanding of Call-Me's glassy look that
"It will be some years before [Cromwell] understands why."
I think Call-me wants Cromwell to be more open about what he thinks. But Call-me works for, or has worked for, Gardiner so there will always be a limit to Cromwell's candour.
And in Angels, Cromwell muses that he will turn Call-Me eventually from Gardiner to him. He will show him where his true interests lie. I think that glassy eye should make him doubt that.
It really is. And hard to catch in this book in particular because it moves so fast it's easy to get swept up. I'm certain I didn't notice this at all on my first read.
I know, it is jarring. But I'm also starting to wonder whether Crum is turning to Walter because his other ghosts wouldn't approve of what he's doing...
My take is that Cromwell is thinking of his Dad because being with angry Henry is much like being with an abusive parent- hypervigilance etc. Because he needs Henry to be 'safe' in order to survive, he is trying to rationalise abusiveness
I'm thinking about Cromwell's belly, protected with iron armor, but soft and vulnerable behind it. He can withstand minor blows from courtiers, but another of those big punches from Henry and he's a goner. He knows it, he's trying not to dwell on it but he knows it.
As he shields his belly and heart he's patiently trying to get to Henry's, but now there's another heart he needs to penetrate: Anne's, just as guarded as him, just barely withstanding the attacks, but ready to fight and bite till the end. He's about to cannibalize his own mirror image!
Also interesting: when Cromwell thinks about his own "iron belly" he remembers Walter, and there's that almost-comic remembered scene when he runs headfirst into the body armor Walter has made and is trying on, just in case he has to defend Putney against the Cornish rebels. That uprising (1497) was a Big Deal. The boy Cromwell would have been 12.
Rageful Henry is terrifying. One thing that occurred to me about Henry's increasingly erratic behaviour in this phase of the book is that- as well as being in pain from his leg- the smack on the head in the jousts that almost killed him would likely count as a pretty serious head injury, no?
He is terrifying - a threat before and the head injury just adds to it. So scary. I can't imagine choosing the path Cromwell takes. Clearly I'm not cut out for court intrigue.
I got today's update and got VERY confused thinking, "Wait... I read ahead, AGAIN, and didn't even realize it?!" Apparently I read through both parts one and two last week, and am well on my way into Master of Phantoms. Summer break is really getting to me!
The standout moment for me from this whole chapter was Chapuys with Anne. The tension!
Simon, just a thought- as page numbers only apply to a certain edition, I have found the reading schedule confusing and more than once found myself reading too far. I think instead of (or as well as) page numbers it would be helpful to specify 'Section beginning with [sentence X] and ending with [sentence Y].' Sorry, I know that would be a lot of labour
You sometimes include a starting or finishing sentence, but not both, and often it is just page numbers, which is fine if one has the correct edition but can be confusing if one doesn't. I've mostly worked your system out now but it can still be tricky and at the start I often read two weeks worth at once by mistake
Oh, sorry, that's not deliberate. There shouldn't be any instances of just page numbers. I'll keep an eye out in the editing to make sure they get sorted.
Ah, yes thanks I remember seeing something about this now! Interesting! Mantel sneekily manages to get Catherine Howard and Katherine Parr into these books, so that all six queens feature – even if Cromwell only lives to see the first four.
One thing I'm wondering, and it may just be that I'm being a bit slow, but do we think Cromwell believes Anne is actually planning something or is that just his way of saying he's going to make something up and accuse her of it? This is the only point in the story that I begin to feel sympathy for Anne, because she is now trapped by these powerful men and it will end badly.
I experience this whole chapter like a rollercoaster - moments of steadiness and then the drop, the falling sensation, the held breath. Fear for Crumb, even though I know how it ends. I'm also noticing on this read how often Crumb's thoughts turn to his family. I'll have to look out for that in Mirror when we get there.
I liked the crossing of the arms to deflect pain, such a powerful gesture too. Like a rebuke, or a refusal to let Henry's violence any closer. I think you're right about Henry's temper being influenced by his injured leg, certainly as the story progresses. Chronic illness really does take its toll. There's reference to Hilary's own struggles in this section when they are discussing Mary's potentially wandering womb.
So much happens in this book in such a short space of time. I forgot about the time-frame until you mentioned it was only a month from now until Anne's end. It feels odd to be slowly reading something that is actually quite fast paced.
The crossed arms really struck me. Confuse the pain and say a prayer and you might be okay. Yikes! Walter as ghostly protector against the King (his only friend) really is something.
Maybe there's something about the increasing realization of Henry as a threat that gives him a renewed view of Walter. Henry was mostly congenial and kid-like in book 1 and earlier in book 2 - now he is terrifying. Walter was terrifying and violent in book 1 and now we get glimpses of his - kindness might be too strong a word - but something like kindness. It's like their opposite qualities are shadowing them. And Cromwell dances somewhere in the middle.
That portrait of Carew looks a lot like my friend's new boyfriend Francis or as I call him 'Big Frank'. I showed her and she agreed there was a strong resemblance but then later she showed him... He was not flattered by the comparison
So Simon I will see you at the Wolf Hall Weekend. I’m not reading along but that’s because I am always reading the trilogy (literally, well, almost) so I’m on The Mirror and the Light at the moment.
I haven't started Bring Up the Bodies... So I'm probably quite behind but I have next week off work so that's a firm time to sit down and read for sure! I hope you have a fab time at the Wolf Hall weekend!
This scene is so ... eerie, unsettling ... "He shouts for the waiters. [...] It seems the meat is fresh, in fact not slaughtered yet. [...] The company must sit and salivate. The Boleyns are laid at his hands to be carved. [...]
This section really brought home to me the impossibility of consistently pleasing Henry: "To succeed with him, one must anticipate his desires. But one then stands exposed, should he change his mind." Cromwell's caution to Fitzwilliam really got under my skin - the idea that it would still be treason to speak against the queen even if you were agreeing with something Henry himself had said - I haven't been able to get this deadly paradox out of my head.
Henry losing his temper with Cromwell was terrifying ("He will never claim, later, that his heart did not turn over") but I found it almost more chilling when Cromwell was described lying awake at night trying unsuccessfully to persuade himself that his was the kind of job you end up "honourably retired" from.
On a lighter note: last week we were reminded that Cromwell is attracted to women who can understand his life; this week, on the other hand, Henry was said to like Jane Seymour because "He thinks she's stupid. He finds it restful." (The perfect antidote to Mantel’s Anne...!)
Such a moving chapter. So much is happening. The king is scary and we’ve never seen Crumb so vulnerable he’s even calling on his abusive father to protect him. And poor Chapuys! Who would want the job of Imperial Ambassador during that time? After his bollocking from Henry he ‘fizzes across the room, gibbering’ had me smiling at Hilary’s turns of phrase. And such interesting notes too, Simon. Thanks and enjoy the weekend. Wish I could be there too.
That last line, "I can’t slow down, if I stopped to think how I was doing it I couldn’t do it at all" takes on such an ominous meaning when you think about what's to come. Liz's fingers had the surety of a skilled craftsperson such that she couldn't do her work slowly- but hers was an act of creation. Cromwell's act, that he can't think too slowly about, is an act of destruction. And now I'm wondering what Liz would have made of what he's about to do.
I tried to vote in the survey on desktop, and it gave me an error, but I was able to vote via the app on my phone.
I feel Wolsey's ghost must be squirming too. And now I have another sense of why Walter's shade was required at this juncture.
I wonder this often. Would more women around him have made him less likely to take the route he ultimately chooses? If Liz had survived would he have made the same choices?
I've wondered that too. He's careful to send Gregory away so he won't have to witness it if it goes bad. Would he have avoided it all if Liz and the girls had lived?
No, I think he would have just sent them all away. In his mind, he’s doing what needs to be done.
There's a moment near the end of the chapter when Call-Me gives Cromwell a "glassy look" regarding Cromwell's shrug about a rumor of a marriage between Mary and a subject. Mantel then writes about Cromwell's understanding of Call-Me's glassy look that
"It will be some years before [Cromwell] understands why."
I found that line to be unusually mysterious.
Yes! I was trying to figure that one out - and I've read the books several times already. I'm going to keep a close eye on Call-Me from now on.
I wondered whether Call-Me thought Cromwell was the intended husband & was highly unimpressed.
😂 smh
I think Call-me wants Cromwell to be more open about what he thinks. But Call-me works for, or has worked for, Gardiner so there will always be a limit to Cromwell's candour.
And in Angels, Cromwell muses that he will turn Call-Me eventually from Gardiner to him. He will show him where his true interests lie. I think that glassy eye should make him doubt that.
It will be fun to see if we can trace this glassy look later.
Call-Me never fails to creep me out.
It will be fun to see if we can trace this glassy look later.
Fascinating about the changing perception of Walter, and such a brilliant weave-in of unreliable memory (both on Hilary’s and your part, Simon)
This is very much a slow read observation!
Nooooooo. I think he’s making excuses for an abusive parent to try to come to terms with it.
You're probably right...
Perhaps to make his own behaviour more palatable? I think there is also a little part of him acknowledging that Walter's abuse helped shape him.
It’s true that an unreliable memory can go in the self-gaslighting direction!
It really is. And hard to catch in this book in particular because it moves so fast it's easy to get swept up. I'm certain I didn't notice this at all on my first read.
I have real problems with the fictional Crum becoming more reconciled to Water. It upsets me.
I know, it is jarring. But I'm also starting to wonder whether Crum is turning to Walter because his other ghosts wouldn't approve of what he's doing...
My take is that Cromwell is thinking of his Dad because being with angry Henry is much like being with an abusive parent- hypervigilance etc. Because he needs Henry to be 'safe' in order to survive, he is trying to rationalise abusiveness
Wolsey was the Good Dad, and Henry is the Bad Dad
I'm thinking about Cromwell's belly, protected with iron armor, but soft and vulnerable behind it. He can withstand minor blows from courtiers, but another of those big punches from Henry and he's a goner. He knows it, he's trying not to dwell on it but he knows it.
As he shields his belly and heart he's patiently trying to get to Henry's, but now there's another heart he needs to penetrate: Anne's, just as guarded as him, just barely withstanding the attacks, but ready to fight and bite till the end. He's about to cannibalize his own mirror image!
I can't watch! 🫣
Also interesting: when Cromwell thinks about his own "iron belly" he remembers Walter, and there's that almost-comic remembered scene when he runs headfirst into the body armor Walter has made and is trying on, just in case he has to defend Putney against the Cornish rebels. That uprising (1497) was a Big Deal. The boy Cromwell would have been 12.
Rageful Henry is terrifying. One thing that occurred to me about Henry's increasingly erratic behaviour in this phase of the book is that- as well as being in pain from his leg- the smack on the head in the jousts that almost killed him would likely count as a pretty serious head injury, no?
Absolutely! Irritably and traumatic brain injuries go hand in hand
He is terrifying - a threat before and the head injury just adds to it. So scary. I can't imagine choosing the path Cromwell takes. Clearly I'm not cut out for court intrigue.
My quote of the week: But now our requirements have changed aged, and the facts have changed behind us.
Never forget that history is written by the victors and we have forever lived in a post-truth world 😅
I got today's update and got VERY confused thinking, "Wait... I read ahead, AGAIN, and didn't even realize it?!" Apparently I read through both parts one and two last week, and am well on my way into Master of Phantoms. Summer break is really getting to me!
The standout moment for me from this whole chapter was Chapuys with Anne. The tension!
It's that kind of book! A real nail biter!
Simon, just a thought- as page numbers only apply to a certain edition, I have found the reading schedule confusing and more than once found myself reading too far. I think instead of (or as well as) page numbers it would be helpful to specify 'Section beginning with [sentence X] and ending with [sentence Y].' Sorry, I know that would be a lot of labour
That's exactly what I have already done in the reading schedule: I include the starting or finishing sentence to make things easier.
You sometimes include a starting or finishing sentence, but not both, and often it is just page numbers, which is fine if one has the correct edition but can be confusing if one doesn't. I've mostly worked your system out now but it can still be tricky and at the start I often read two weeks worth at once by mistake
Oh, sorry, that's not deliberate. There shouldn't be any instances of just page numbers. I'll keep an eye out in the editing to make sure they get sorted.
Thank you Simon! This reading schedule is what I mean, to be clear: https://footnotesandtangents.substack.com/p/2024-cromwell-trilogy-reading-schedule
This has probably been asked in Chat, which I've been MIA from for a bit... but have you seen the trailer for Firebrand?!
What's Firebrand? I haven't heard of it.
It's the new movie about Katherine Parr (and Henry) that's finally being released here in US, this weekend. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oyAK_isFwbU
Ah, yes thanks I remember seeing something about this now! Interesting! Mantel sneekily manages to get Catherine Howard and Katherine Parr into these books, so that all six queens feature – even if Cromwell only lives to see the first four.
What??? Jude Law as Henry????!!! 😳😱 Interesting! 🪓
Right?!
I have to admit that I laughed at the dramatic 'based on true events' text that they used.
I did too!
This chapter was full of wonderful moments.
One thing I'm wondering, and it may just be that I'm being a bit slow, but do we think Cromwell believes Anne is actually planning something or is that just his way of saying he's going to make something up and accuse her of it? This is the only point in the story that I begin to feel sympathy for Anne, because she is now trapped by these powerful men and it will end badly.
I experience this whole chapter like a rollercoaster - moments of steadiness and then the drop, the falling sensation, the held breath. Fear for Crumb, even though I know how it ends. I'm also noticing on this read how often Crumb's thoughts turn to his family. I'll have to look out for that in Mirror when we get there.
I liked the crossing of the arms to deflect pain, such a powerful gesture too. Like a rebuke, or a refusal to let Henry's violence any closer. I think you're right about Henry's temper being influenced by his injured leg, certainly as the story progresses. Chronic illness really does take its toll. There's reference to Hilary's own struggles in this section when they are discussing Mary's potentially wandering womb.
So much happens in this book in such a short space of time. I forgot about the time-frame until you mentioned it was only a month from now until Anne's end. It feels odd to be slowly reading something that is actually quite fast paced.
The crossed arms really struck me. Confuse the pain and say a prayer and you might be okay. Yikes! Walter as ghostly protector against the King (his only friend) really is something.
Maybe there's something about the increasing realization of Henry as a threat that gives him a renewed view of Walter. Henry was mostly congenial and kid-like in book 1 and earlier in book 2 - now he is terrifying. Walter was terrifying and violent in book 1 and now we get glimpses of his - kindness might be too strong a word - but something like kindness. It's like their opposite qualities are shadowing them. And Cromwell dances somewhere in the middle.
That portrait of Carew looks a lot like my friend's new boyfriend Francis or as I call him 'Big Frank'. I showed her and she agreed there was a strong resemblance but then later she showed him... He was not flattered by the comparison
Ha! I hope Francis doesn't admire his reflection quite as much as Carew.
So Simon I will see you at the Wolf Hall Weekend. I’m not reading along but that’s because I am always reading the trilogy (literally, well, almost) so I’m on The Mirror and the Light at the moment.
You know preparing for the Exeter conspiracy has given me whiplash. 1538 feels like a different world. June, 1536 feels like a different country.
Will see you at Wolf Hall Weekend!
See you there Jim!
Also, Call-Me and his glassy stare. Oh dear...
I haven't started Bring Up the Bodies... So I'm probably quite behind but I have next week off work so that's a firm time to sit down and read for sure! I hope you have a fab time at the Wolf Hall weekend!
Thanks Liv! Enjoy catching up!
This scene is so ... eerie, unsettling ... "He shouts for the waiters. [...] It seems the meat is fresh, in fact not slaughtered yet. [...] The company must sit and salivate. The Boleyns are laid at his hands to be carved. [...]
Stuff of nightmares ... 😳😱🪓
Thank you for another excellent set of notes.
This section really brought home to me the impossibility of consistently pleasing Henry: "To succeed with him, one must anticipate his desires. But one then stands exposed, should he change his mind." Cromwell's caution to Fitzwilliam really got under my skin - the idea that it would still be treason to speak against the queen even if you were agreeing with something Henry himself had said - I haven't been able to get this deadly paradox out of my head.
Henry losing his temper with Cromwell was terrifying ("He will never claim, later, that his heart did not turn over") but I found it almost more chilling when Cromwell was described lying awake at night trying unsuccessfully to persuade himself that his was the kind of job you end up "honourably retired" from.
On a lighter note: last week we were reminded that Cromwell is attracted to women who can understand his life; this week, on the other hand, Henry was said to like Jane Seymour because "He thinks she's stupid. He finds it restful." (The perfect antidote to Mantel’s Anne...!)
Such a moving chapter. So much is happening. The king is scary and we’ve never seen Crumb so vulnerable he’s even calling on his abusive father to protect him. And poor Chapuys! Who would want the job of Imperial Ambassador during that time? After his bollocking from Henry he ‘fizzes across the room, gibbering’ had me smiling at Hilary’s turns of phrase. And such interesting notes too, Simon. Thanks and enjoy the weekend. Wish I could be there too.